JUANA SUMMERS, HOST:
Pope Francis' coffin has been sealed after three days of lying in state in St. Peter's Basilica. Now the Vatican is making final preparations for his funeral Saturday morning. Joining us from Rome to talk about what to expect from the funeral and the conclave to follow are NPR's religion correspondent Jason DeRose and Religion News Service Vatican correspondent Claire Giangrave, who are standing just outside St. Peter's Square. Hi to both of you.
JASON DEROSE, BYLINE: Hello.
CLAIRE GIANGRAVE: Hello.
SUMMERS: Jason, I want to start with you. Tell us what we know about the funeral itself.
DEROSE: Well, first let me apologize for the commotion and perhaps the helicopters circling above here just outside St. Peter's Square. What we know about the service is that it's a traditional Roman Catholic requiem Mass, a service that prays for God to grant the deceased eternal peace. The Mass is predominantly in Latin, the official language of the church, but some of the elements are in other languages - Arabic, Portuguese, Chinese - languages spoken in places outside Europe, in the Global South, where the church is growing and, frankly, more vibrant.
The very traditional psalm "The Lord Is My Shepherd" will be part of the liturgy, and the gospel reading is from John. It's the story of Jesus asking Simon Peter three times, do you love me? Simon Peter says, yes, three times. And each time, Jesus says, feed my flock. I'll be interested in hearing how the homily might reflect Francis' understanding of himself as a shepherd. And then near the end of the requiem Mass is this incredibly moving antiphon, "In Paradisum." It's sung in Latin, but the text translates this way - may the angels lead you into paradise.
SUMMERS: Claire, to you. The pope is not actually going to be buried at St. Peter's but instead at St. Mary Major Basilica. Tell us why.
GIANGRAVE: Yes, in many ways, this is another break from tradition for Pope Francis. The last pope to be buried in St. Mary Major was in the 1600s. This was a choice really born from Pope Francis' own special devotion to Mary. He wanted to be buried as close as possible to one of the most ancient and precious icons of the Virgin Mary, the Salus Populus Romani (ph). Now, Pope Francis would go and pray in front of that icon before and after every trip and even when he left the hospital where he was treated for double pneumonia.
Greeting his body on Saturday on the steps of St. Mary Major, there will be a number of people representing all those that Pope Francis helped during his life. The unhoused, the trans community, prisoners and migrants will be there holding a white rose. They say this will be their last goodbye.
SUMMERS: Jason, what happens after the funeral and the burial?
DEROSE: The funeral, Juana, marks the beginning of something called the novemdialis. It's this ancient tradition of nine days of mourning and daily Masses for the repose of the late pope's soul. But the cardinals will be busy outside those Masses. They're meeting in congregations to get to know each other. Francis appointed the vast majority of electors. So this is the first time they'll all be coming together to think about the current state of the Catholic Church, what they're looking for in the next pope and what issues the future pope might need to address. And then following those meetings and Masses, the conclave itself begins, when all the electors are cloistered in the Sistine Chapel and at a nearby guesthouse until they select the next leader of the Roman Catholic Church.
SUMMERS: Claire, so many of us have been watching this, and there has been just a lot of talk about who might be emerging as front-runners in the conclave to elect the next pope. Tell us a bit about what we might expect from this conclave and when it might begin.
GIANGRAVE: Well, even though an official date has not been released by the Vatican yet, we can expect that sometime around May 6, cardinals will convene for the conclave. Now, there are 200 cardinals overall, but only 135 will be voting because they are under the age of 80. The older cardinals will, even if they can't vote, have an important role in advising the conversation.
But conversations about who might be the next pope are already happening in Rome. Pietro Parolin has emerged as a very probable candidate. He is a respected figure in the church as the No. 2 official at the Vatican and a close ally to Pope Francis. For conservatives, the Hungarian cardinal, Peter Erdo, seems like an obvious choice as someone who can bridge divides between East and West while upholding tradition.
Many think that it's time for an Italian to come back and become pope, and for them, Cardinal Zuppi might be a favorite, especially among progressives in Italy. And there will be many cardinals from Asia in this conclave who think that the Filipino cardinal, Tagle, might be the right choice for his strong charisma and outreach towards young people. But it's difficult to predict what happens in the Sistine Chapel once those doors are closed, and we really don't know who the next pope will be until he appears on the balcony of St. Peter's Basilica.
SUMMERS: That's Religion News Service Vatican correspondent Claire Giangrave and NPR's religion correspondent Jason DeRose. They're both in Rome. Claire and Jason, thank you so much for your reporting.
DEROSE: You're welcome.
GIANGRAVE: You're welcome.
SUMMERS: This story was produced through a collaboration between NPR and Religion News Service. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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