MICHEL MARTIN, HOST:
For more on this, we want to turn to someone who knows the area well. Martin Gordon is the Anglican Bishop of Goma. That's the city in the Democratic Republic of Congo that rebels have taken over. He fled with his family on Saturday, the day after Goma lost power. Today, he's issuing a call for peace, and he's with us now. Good morning, Bishop. Thank you for joining us.
MARTIN GORDON: Good morning. Good to be with you.
MARTIN: Can you just share with us your experience of leaving Goma? What was the city like when you left?
GORDON: We left on Saturday lunchtime. It was eerily quiet. Some of our friends and others had been leaving from Thursday. But the city of Sake to the west of Goma, which was a red line for many NGOs that had fallen, and our government had already suggested that all its citizens left. So we had some time. We had some time to pack. We drove over the border in relative calm. And as we crossed the border, we saw many of our friends and colleagues, particularly those with children, also seeking to leave.
I mean, ironically, one of the challenge - the main challenge we had leaving that day was to get our car papers in order. But we know that we're some of the few with the possibility and the means to escape. Most of the clergy and all of the believers, the Anglican believers, and all of our other colleagues are still in Goma. And they're the ones who have been suffering. Goma has had no power since Friday. Internet's been patchy. There's little water in some of the city. Hospitals are overflowing.
And with the battle that then took to the streets of Goma, many civilians were caught in the crossfire. There's eyewitness accounts of bodies in the streets, and food prices have doubled. So there seems to be chaos on the ground, and fighting is still in pockets of the town.
MARTIN: Now, you've lived in Goma for about five years. Has this conflict touched members of the diocese before?
GORDON: It has. It's something that - conflict in eastern Congo is something that we have lived with for 30 years. But between 2012 and 2021, there was relative calm. And then the M23 took up arms again in 2021. And so our diocese covers much, much more than Goma in the north in Rutshuru and in the west in Masisi. We've had schools that have been destroyed by bombs. We've had many of our clergy at one point in the last two or three years have had to flee for their lives and hide in the forests. We've had roadblocks. We've had increasing food prices.
It's essentially paralyzing activities in North Kivu. But until really this month, Goma was largely spared. And so the conflict is not new, but what is new and what has caught the world's attention and what may put an end to the conflict now is the fact that the city of Goma seems to be largely in the hands of the Rwandan-backed M23 rebels.
MARTIN: Now, we've been hearing about destruction taking place at foreign embassies in Kinshasa, which is the capital. People are angry at international powers for not intervening. And I understand that you are a clergyman. You're not a diplomat. But from where you sit and from what you see, what would be helpful here for the international community to do to respond to this?
GORDON: So you're right. I mean, the anger and the frustration that just burst into life in Kinshasa, and we're not in any way condoning what happened to the embassies, is the measure of frustration that this is new. We've been saying this. The Congolese people have been saying this for years. And there have been many fine-sounding statements from the U.N. from the European community. What we need now is action. So what the U.N. Security Council have said, what the U.S. secretary of state has said in a phone call, both to President Tshisekedi of DRC and Kagame of Rwanda, is absolutely right, the M23 must withdraw. Rwanda must draw its own troops.
But we need an immediate ceasefire, a cessation of hostilities, humanitarian access. But the international community now needs to step up and go beyond fine-sounding statements and to put the necessary pressure, particularly on the Rwandan government, to withdraw to allow aid access. And the only solution, as everyone is saying, is a negotiated solution. So the international community needs to do everything it can to get people around the table and to use its economic and its diplomatic muscle and its financial muscle to enable peace in the region because this could spill into a regional conflict. And all the Congolese people really want is peace and a chance to go about their daily lives.
MARTIN: That's Martin Gordon. He's the Anglican Bishop of Goma. He escaped from Goma with his family on Saturday. Bishop Gordon, thank you so much for talking with us.
GORDON: Thank you.
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